My design for a TAPS3-VX

[JohnnieMo]

I sure wish I could try both an AVx boat and a TAPS3 boat. However my wife says we can't go to the reunion

One thing I've noticed about TAPS3 is the significance of the middle tab. It is much larger and longer than the old TAPS2 plate. It is what you need to remove that "rooster tail". It is basically performing the work of the "tunnel" of the Vx. That combined with the outer tabs does a nice job cleaning up the wave surface.

After my most recent tests, I am more in favour of keeping the Vx than I was before. Even keeping it at the Rev 2 angle. That wave I had in Shuswap was the best wave I have ever surfed, and with only 3 people in the boat. No extra sacks or lead. Just my home made suck gate.

As has been said - adjustability is key. I'm thinking it might make sense to design a gate system instead of a tab system. I have got ideas for both implementations.

I am going to try a couple more tests this fall, weather permitting. One will be to build a new tab to match the Centurion design (they are the only tabs without a hook in them). The other would be to fabricate a gate that doesn't use suction cups and mounts on the outside of the Vx.

Centurion


Mastercraft


Tige TAPS3


GO Surf Assist


Axis


Malibu

[Germaine Marine]

Just go with a taps 3 plate system. It's proved its a hybrid of all that has come before it and my pictures prove how insane the wave is....

I like your enthusiasm to innovate but I would venture to guess Tige went down that road and it lead to taps3 which is proving to be the superior in systems to date...

[Greeko]

Here is a comparative video I threw together.

https://youtu.be/Dxfa26xFnsM

This shows the difference between a normal list, the tab, and the gate. Observe the mountains in the background to estimate wave height.

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For what its worth, i am extremely happy with my 15 z3 with avx. I think if you put more lead in the back corners and dont put as much weight into the bow you will be very happy with the results..If you really want to make a surf gadget... make an adjustable VX.

If you were in osoyoos I would show you what it can do!

[jslayde1]

... I've done it long enough and smoked a motor from oil starvation.

Can you give us more details into this for everyones awareness? I would think there are thousands of hours of listed surfing in this forum alone, and I have not heard of anyone ruining a motor from it.

Any details would be appreciated.

[dukesofhazzard]

thanks

[Taylormoto]

Fastnel.

taylormoto
where do you get that adj pin from?

[dukesofhazzard]

taylormoto
where do you get that adj pin from?

[Taylormoto]

A good sucgate seems to do just fine but like stated in the original post it needs to be adjustable. I have been able to adjust the angle to around 25° and get a great wave. This angle makes the engine work much easier and I have no problems steering in any direction. In the pic with the girl rider we are going 14.8 on my phone. the other is dropped down to 11.6 both very surfable waves with no list at all. Many people are having problems with the suction cups not sticking and that's due to the boat cleaner you are using. Many products have silicone in them and they will never stick to the boat after use. Alcohol wipe will clen it off enough but not take you r polish off. I have never had mine fall off yet but the Mission delta that is rotting away in my garage falls off every 30 min or so. I have prototyped three of these now and everyone is loving it. Sure you can get the same wave listed but who wants to drive and hang out on a listed boat? Not me! I've done it long enough and smoked a motor from oil starvation. To put a Y pickup is more then buying a adjustable tab setup anyways. I'm not selling my gates just giving people ideas to see what people can come up with. So fire away with questions or even what you don't like about it. Everything on my gate is one off machined accept the hinge, adjuster pin, and suction cups.
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[JohnnieMo]

Another weekend, another test. This time I removed the Vx completely. Unfortunately some variables changed. I had 5 large adults this time, although mostly I kept them on the middle of the boat. We were also surfing throughout, so that made it hard to get captures. Also at a different lake (sigh).

Watch the video and then I'll comment:

https://youtu.be/G_JvMRa85iI

Overall, running at TAPS8 and 11 MPH was impossible. Without the Vx, you really needs the TAPS plate again. With the Vx you essentially just get the TAPS plate out of the way. (that's why Wake9 made a custom plate which I use). So we found the best wave was listed fully, add the suck gate 3 feet from the transom, and 11 MPH, TAPS3. The boat had some issues with vibration which you can see on another thread.

The wave itself was a messier wave. It was very tall with a tight hook. Not nearly as smooth as the Vx wave. The added bodies didn't make the wave better than what I had in my last video. If anything it made it worse.

Another side note was the exhaust. I now see why people get FAE. The Vx gets rid of 95% of it. It was a foggy nightmare back there. (cold day didn't help)

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I'm prepared to say the best wave I've had to date is with the Vx, TAPS8, and suck gate right at the rear. I'm almost prepared to say I might just go with that from here on out. But we know I'm never done tinkering.

For my next test I am going to make a new shaped tab and try it. A jig saw makes that test real easy

[JohnnieMo]

What exactly are u wanting pics and measurements of johnnie? I'm at the lake this weekend so I can get u what u need

Well for vids, if you happen to have access to a Suck Gate, it would be awesome to see how the Suck Gate compares to TAPS3. So I would say run either and record with a video using standard variables. For instance, I find it works best when you keep the people in the same spots, and travel the same direction. Obviously get the camera in the same spot also.

As for measurements - just of the TAPS3 tabs themselves. Then we as a community can determine how they differ on a Z1 from a Z3 or an RZX. However there is no rush on this. It would be a winter project to fabricate these.

[ChrisBarnes05-12-84]

What exactly are u wanting pics and measurements of johnnie? I'm at the lake this weekend so I can get u what u need

[UNSTUCK]

Interesting. That one does not have the bend on the left side of the tab (looking at your lower picture or the right side looking at the upper picture). So they did away with the bend that was riveted on, then built into the tab.

[JohnnieMo]

That is very insightful. You can see into the minds of the Tigé R&D engineers. I think the hook and the angle are significant. The hook slows down the boat much like a gate does. This creates the crab walk effect.... As does the inward turn on the tab. Mine does neither and the effects are obvious.

I think a smaller tab with a hook is a better approach. I want to study the go surf assist also. They have good results too.

If I was to fabricate my own tabs I think I would go with powder coated steel to match my taps2 plate. (Which BTW is radically different in the post Vx era).

For reference here are some pics I snapped of a 2016 Z3 at the dealer.





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[UNSTUCK]

I did sell off my system. I'll let him post up if he wishes to out himself. His boat is none of the above, so I look forward to see his results. I'm sure it will be better than mine.

When I started doing my research (November-December of last year) I could only find two boats locally that had taps 3 installed. They were parked right next to each other. One was the RZX that I copied off of, the other was a Z3. There were two differences that I noticed. The first was the transom mounting flange. The Z3 had the middle section removed so it would clear that swim platforms mounting bracket. So that tab was held on with 4-5 less screws than the the RZX which was just a straight flange. The second thing I noticed was that the 90* bend on the inside of the tab was a second piece of SS that was riveted on. That was on the Z3. The RZX had the same bend, but was bent right on the main piece of SS. So that is what I did with mine. All one piece. This clues us in on the progression of the taps 3 tab. First they tried it as a flat tab then it progressed to have the bends in it. They didn't want to waste the tabs they already made, so they modified them with the riveted on piece.
I can't say what a Z1 has, but my money is that it's the same size/shape as the others. I'd like to think it would be smaller because of the bad handling of my boat with such a big tab, but it could just be my boat, being so old.

My cost to build my system ended up being about $1200. This included a few returned parts shipping, ect. It could be done a bit cheaper, but this is the best way and will most closely resemble a stock TAPS 3 system. That is still less than half the cost of the company selling the retrofit kits. Keep in mind, this is no automated system like the real TAPS 3, the switches are manually operated and it will require installation and maybe even slight modifications of your boat, or of the system to work together. If you want to put your own kit together, I can build the tabs for about $500. My hinges were bolted to the tabs, but I could weld them together as well, just like I welded the tab corners together. Something Tige did not do on the RZX, but I think should have.

[JohnnieMo]

Ya... basically if you watch the video closely you will notice the Suck Gate wins. Regardless of ballast. The tab helps to clean up the wave (see the 22 deg wave) but it also dampens a bit. I think the major issue is the size of the tab. It is so big it actually pushes down the bow. (much like the TAPS2 plate). So it dampens the wave, but could also be changing the perspective of the camera slightly. I think a smaller tab could be more effective. Either way I think I'm starting to learn more and more why the TAPS3 plate is what it is. It is no accident.

You'll also note how drastically the shape of the wave changes between the Suck Gate and the tab. The wave gets pointy at the top, with a long and flat transition. Again, I have no idea why. It is sort of trial and error to figure this out.

UNSTUCK - I have been thinking about your TAPS21 throughout. Did you find a buyer for it? I asked at my dealer about buying an official TAPS3 kit and he said it wasn't available. He also said that each boat uses unique tabs. So a Z1 is different than a Z3 is different than an RZX. So if I did go the TAPS21 route, I would want to copy the Z1 tab. (perhaps my good friend Chris Barnes can take some measurements and post some videos???? )

If anyone is willing to run a test, I'd love to see a TAPS3 Z1 (or Z3) using TAPS3 and then immediately compared to listed with a suck gate. I'd be curious to see the result.

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I'm going to try removing the Vx entirely for my next test and running the Suck Gate with it. I think that will calm the rooster tail.