2020 RZX2 questions re: fuel gauge and ballast pump

[Bamer]

Ok update on the gas gauge issue: it’s not the gauge. Last gas refill, the pump turned off after adding about 25 gallons, but I was able to add another 22 gallons (!) but only by filling very slowly, meaning that I was manually reducing the fill rate to avoid the gas pump’s auto shutoff. So does this mean that there is a vent line issue or something of the sort? I assume this is not normal?

I fill on slow too....


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[MikeB313]

I have no issues filling my tank and it reads 100%. I usually fill on the water when boat is floating, but the times I trailer it, my hitch height keeps the boat about level and no issues then either.

[bridgerider]

also, update on the ballast pump issue:
1. now it's happening with the aft starboard fill pump too
2. turning the pumps on and off doesn't seem to help
3. priming the pumps doesn't seem to help (i.e. remove the cover from the pump, letting water flow out, then replace cover)
4. rapid deceleration did start them flowing one time, but i have not tried a repeat test yet
5. after i did get it going the one time with rapid deceleration, the aft port bag made fairly loud gurgling/bubbling noises as it filled; the aft starboard bag was pretty quiet; no idea what this means, if anything

when i get a chance i'm going to try freeheel4life 's suggestion, although i'm not sure what you mean about "add another wrap or two"?

Still aerators.

bridgerider have seen a few pumps where the pump isn't securely screwed to the thru hull fitting and I believe its air locking below the impeller. Ive removed the pumps from their thru hull fitting, added another wrap or two and then made sure they are screwed all the way onto the thru hull fitting and so far I haven't had any more complaints .

[freeheel4life]

bridgerider sorry for the typo....the pumps get Teflon and are and NPT fitting. Adding a wrap or two of teflon and threading back into the thru hull(have never confirmed if the female ball valve is NPT or not). You could also slather the maker side of housing with PTFE paste and make sure it seats.

As a tech no news is sometimes good news. Cant confirm my fix but if pumps werent filling still Id be hearing about it. This has been my fix....but its also been obvious the pump housing wasnt super tight to the thru hull in the cases Im referring to. If the pump is easy to turn left and right on the thru hull Id start there.

[BrentP]

Ok update on the gas gauge issue: it’s not the gauge. Last gas refill, the pump turned off after adding about 25 gallons, but I was able to add another 22 gallons (!) but only by filling very slowly, meaning that I was manually reducing the fill rate to avoid the gas pump’s auto shutoff. So does this mean that there is a vent line issue or something of the sort? I assume this is not normal?

We fill my boat on the water. You MUST go at half speed. We can debate whether it’s the vent or what - I think it’s because the fill tube on a boat is so long, it just can’t handle the full tilt volume coming from a gas pump. Either way, I fill on volume not on when it stops. If the gas gauge shows

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[bridgerider]

We fill my boat on the water. You MUST go at half speed. We can debate whether it’s the vent or what - I think it’s because the fill tube on a boat is so long, it just can’t handle the full tilt volume coming from a gas pump. Either way, I fill on volume not on when it stops. If the gas gauge shows

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Have been filling at slow speeds every day for the last few days and now getting 100% on the gauge every time. Thanks for your help on this everyone!

[bridgerider]

bridgerider sorry for the typo....the pumps get Teflon and are and NPT fitting. Adding a wrap or two of teflon and threading back into the thru hull(have never confirmed if the female ball valve is NPT or not). You could also slather the maker side of housing with PTFE paste and make sure it seats.

As a tech no news is sometimes good news. Cant confirm my fix but if pumps werent filling still Id be hearing about it. This has been my fix....but its also been obvious the pump housing wasnt super tight to the thru hull in the cases Im referring to. If the pump is easy to turn left and right on the thru hull Id start there.

I'm a novice regarding ballast pumps, etc, so please bear with me ...

The pumps seems to be firmly affixed into the hull, there is no movement at all and they all seem rock solid. As noted earlier, priming the pumps does not help. However, I traced the hoses from stern locker ballast bags forward to the vented loops (two of them on each side, one mounted vertically and the other mounted horizontally) and check valve (one on each side). I started on the starboard side and noticed that there was air accumulation in the vertically mounted vented loop, so while the pump was on I slowly unscrewed the valve at top of the loop and allowed the air to bleed out of the system. This got the water flowing into bottom of the bag. I am still not getting water flow through into the top of the bag. I had to stop here as I was called away ... but any ideas on why air is getting into the system here?

My next step was to try letting the air out of the system from the horizontally mounted vent loop to see if that made any difference. I will also take some pictures of the setup so you can better see how the system is organized.

[bridgerider]

Following up on prior post:

Releasing air from the horizontal vent loop seemed to start some water flowing into the top of the bag, although I'm not sure why ... it took quite a while for the flow to build up. No air entered the system since last time as far as I can tell so fingers crossed that this will keep working without any interference from me.

I tried the same procedure on the port side for both vent loops and while it did work, the water flow on the port side seems much slower for some reason. I will fill and drain a few more time to get a better idea of what is going on.

Also, if it helps, here are a couple of pictures of the setup on the starboard side. The first shows the vertical vent loop that feeds the bottom of the bag (I think?):

2020-08-21 09.27.28.jpg

And second shows a check valve (?) that then splits up to feed the top of the bag and splits down to the horizontal vent loop that feeds somewhere else that I haven't yet identified:

2020-08-21 09.27.34.jpg

Still no idea how air is getting into the system in the first place. Any and all help appreciated!

[freeheel4life]

bridgerider, so to answer your original question, over explain, and night fight over terminolgy differences, the thru hull/pumps are really 4 pieces. From the bottom of hull....thru hull fitting, then the ball valve, then the pump body threads into the ball valve, and the wired cartridge drops in last. Where the pump body threads into the ball valve is where I've found some loose. You verify this by removing the threaded barbed connector and hose from the pump and then rotating the pump to the right(clockwise). If this was VERY easy to accomplish then the pump bodies need tightened to ball valve.

Hopefully that answers your question...but I think you may have a different problem

Looking at your pics makes me wonder about the plastic fittings that are anti siphon valve..in my experience the vent needs to be pointed skyward so air can get out and not get trapped. It's hard to tell from your picture angles but some of them may not have enough hose length to orient them correctly and may be too low to the waterline as well. Just worth investigating.

https://www.wakemakers.com/vented-lo...8aAjNUEALw_wcB

^^check out this link, pics, and quasi schematic. might help explain their purpose and how they are intended to be used. I dont want to jump to concluions as cell phone pic angles can lead you astray.....upside down in a bilge cussing can make things look askew.

[bridgerider]

bridgerider, so to answer your original question, over explain, and night fight over terminolgy differences, the thru hull/pumps are really 4 pieces. From the bottom of hull....thru hull fitting, then the ball valve, then the pump body threads into the ball valve, and the wired cartridge drops in last. Where the pump body threads into the ball valve is where I've found some loose. You verify this by removing the threaded barbed connector and hose from the pump and then rotating the pump to the right(clockwise). If this was VERY easy to accomplish then the pump bodies need tightened to ball valve.

Hopefully that answers your question...but I think you may have a different problem

Looking at your pics makes me wonder about the plastic fittings that are anti siphon valve..in my experience the vent needs to be pointed skyward so air can get out and not get trapped. It's hard to tell from your picture angles but some of them may not have enough hose length to orient them correctly and may be too low to the waterline as well. Just worth investigating.

Thank you for explaining the thru hulk pump set up. I will take a look as yesterday it felt like repriming the port pump might have worked. It’s so hard to tell though, as I’ve been “fixing” things on the fly with people in the boat who just want to surf! Repriming the starboard pump felt like it had no impact, but again, it was hard for me to tell. At some point after a lot of fiddling, and during surfing, both bags filled.

As for the setup, I tried to hold my phone as level as possible, and yes the anti siphon look on the right side of the second picture is mounted such that the duck valve is in the 3 o’clock position. The ballast system is as it came from the factory and the boat is a 2020 with less than 50 hours on it, so should I be surprised that it is not set up right?

[chpthril]

One potential issue, can be left over fill water sitting on top of a check valve. This hold the flapper closed, preventing the pump from purging trapped.

[KoolAid]

One potential issue, can be left over fill water sitting on top of a check valve. This hold the flapper closed, preventing the pump from purging trapped.

Quick look, this is exactly the issue. The check valve in our setup with a vented loop, should always be horizontal. The vented loop, in your second picture for reference, I tell people to keep the stem pointed to around 3 o'clock to 5 o'clock.

I tell techs and the line that this is ideal:

[bridgerider]

Quick look, this is exactly the issue. The check valve in our setup with a vented loop, should always be horizontal. The vented loop, in your second picture for reference, I tell people to keep the stem pointed to around 3 o'clock to 5 o'clock.

I tell techs and the line that this is ideal:

Three questions:

1. I assume that my local Tige dealer should fix this when I take the boat in for its 50/100 hour service? The current set up is factory installed!

2. Can I show them your picture and quote you on the recommended setup as you are a knowledgeable somebody and I’m just a nagging customer?

3. For my own curiosity, why do you recommend the stem of the vent loop be pointed in the 3- to 5-o’clock position? Everything I’ve read on the internets (e.g. wakemakers) has the stem in the 12 o’clock position. Again, I’m a novice trying to educate myself ...

[KoolAid]

Yes the dealer should do this fix when you take it in for service. Have them contact Justin at Tige about how to repair it. I promise you they know who I am.

We use the vented loop a little differently that what wakemakers sells it for. That is why it needs to be set in the position it is in. We use it to keep the system from automatically filling as do they but we also have a check valve to keep it from automatically draining constantly. Our system requires the two to work together to accomplish our goal.

[bridgerider]

Yes the dealer should do this fix when you take it in for service. Have them contact Justin at Tige about how to repair it. I promise you they know who I am.

We use the vented loop a little differently that what wakemakers sells it for. That is why it needs to be set in the position it is in. We use it to keep the system from automatically filling as do they but we also have a check valve to keep it from automatically draining constantly. Our system requires the two to work together to accomplish our goal.

Fantastic, thank you! The boat is scheduled to be serviced next week, I will keep you posted.