ATX

[NICKYPOO]

How again is 98k budget friendly? I get that it is half of 196k but Christ, budget boats are now 100k? I don’t get it. Tow boats have gone completely off the deep end. I get the bells and whistles thing but a new budget boat is going to give us a 75k better experience?

25k wake...

[UNSTUCK]

If you were to compare a current model RZX2 (RZX2 is more apples to apples than RZX3) with an ATX22 there is not much difference from what I can see. The website lists the price of the RZX at $138,062. My build quote for the ATX with options that would be very similar from audio, to surf system was $126,550.

I think I said it before, but my frustration with the whole ATX thing was the idea of low $70k for one. It's just not a realistic number. You will need to spend WAY more than that to get a usable boat. If we want to talk about how much better ATX is vs Moomba you need to compare them at the same price point. Right now I can buy a NICE floor model Max that is mildly optioned for $64k. I can't even buy an ATX for $64k. So if you purchased the absolute cheapest ATX at $71ish, which boat would be smiling as it blows by the other? The Max would have a nice, if not great surf wave. The ATX would have a white wash mess as it doesn't even have a surf system on it.

In the end, I would have the same payment if not more by buying a new ATX, optioned the way we did vs keeping my RZX that we love. Maybe if we found the limit to our wave and we weren't happy with it.... I don't think we are even close yet to finding our max wave. It keeps getting better and better right now.

[Zackdogg]

Lets clear a few things up here.

First things first lets compare year for year. Your boat is 4 years old. Comparing your 16 to a 2020 is going to get too confusing given inflation and boat costs going up each calendar year and tech being way different in that span.

I dont know how your dealer is handling quotes given we are bombarded with interest but unless people are serious we are quoting MSRP. I dont know how much you have looked around in the last few years but boat prices are up. I just built two boats identically optioned as best I can given the Rzx has more standard features. The difference in MSRP vs MSRP? You guessed it, right at 50K. Meaning, you shop an ATX vs an RZX, in most cases the price difference is going to be somewhere in that 42-50K gap range option for option motor for motor. If you are buying an ATX at msrp its going to be 145K, and if you buy an RZX at MSRP its going to be 195K loaded vs loaded on the 460.


This whole "flagship" terms gets tossed around way too much. What does that mean exactly? Tiges best boat? To who? Everyone values different things. The Rzx was designed in 2016 off the ASR. The running surface hasnt changed since it was born 4 years ago. Since then 6 new running surfaces have been designed and tested and things learned in the process. Here is my question. Is it reasonable to expect that Tige in the last 4 years has not evolved in terms of running surfaces? If new models (Zx, RZX20 etc) have all been new designs that have gotten better with each attempt what would make you think that they would go backwards with the ATX? Are you saying that they would intentionally do that so as to keep the Rzx a more premium model?

Not ever going to be the case. Rzx was the flagship, still is amazing but to think that these other models in terms of running surface, wave etc have not improved is a little naive.

Axis for the sake of this discussion has a limited option pool that consists of nearly 1/4 of the available options. But Ill use that as an example. A T22 prices out at 109K MSRP, If I build an ATX with those same options, boat for boat its right at 98K.

I get it, tough go this year with your RZX. Just want to make sure the right info and perspective is going out about the boats. It gets confusing at times.

Tige offers a stupid arrangement of options even with the ATX.

How good the ATX or any model that has come after it isnt a slight on your boat, its a sign of growth and a healthy evolution from Tige.

I for one love that they want to put out a more budget friendly option that can throw down against any of its models. To me its a bold statement. They wont be going backwards in terms of performance for the sake of money. This is a good thing not a bad one.

Re-reading your first response, I think maybe you misunderstood some of what I was saying. When I said “disappointed”, I was referring to my rzx, not the ATX. The ATX is semi-close to what I figured it would be, pretty similar feeling to a moomba or axis, and that’s admittedly not being on the water, but in a showroom. I don’t have problem with budget boats, I ride with guys that love their Axis, and it’s a good boat. And even more importantly it isn’t in the shop all the time. My point of that statement was only that as much of a disappointment that my RZX is, I still didn’t think I could step back to an ATX.

I fully understand that there have been new designs out by Tige, and I could care less about the term “flagship”, which is why I mocked it in quotes. I also know that boats are more expensive today than they were 3 or 4 years ago.

If the ATX can hang with the boats that people have spent $50k more on, I guess that’s great for the ATX people, and it really sucks for the people that paid a premium for a 2019 boat. Especially if that boat is going to be outdated in one year, or in a lot of cases the same year they bought it. I definitely screwed up buying a boat that doesn’t have a local dealer, but I also see quite a few people on here say they have to drive further than me to get to theirs, so I’m not the only one there. When I bought the boat, I didn’t envision having to drive 2 hours each way 4 times a summer.. I figured a service or 2 a year, and I’d be dialed.

I’ve had plenty of great days on the water, in my boat, but for what it is, and how much they sold it for, it sure does have a bunch of problems. We have probably 12-15 boats in our crew, and every brand of wakeboat, except Moomba, and Supreme. The only ones that cost more we’re the Nautiques
and they are both supercharged. Only 2 boats have had problems the last 2 years, an MB had a throttle sensor go bad that we fixed on the water, one day, and mine which has been to the shop approaching 10 times in 2 seasons, and I would guess has cost me 20 days on the water since I’ve owned the boat, so maybe that makes me a little biased when looking at boats, I’ll admit that. Maybe my dealer just sucks, who knows. I’m pretty frustrated with Tige as a brand, right now, and maybe that’s more because of my dealer than Tige, but that’s my representation of Tige, which shouldn’t be my problem to deal with.


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[Zackdogg]

How again is 98k budget friendly? I get that it is half of 196k but Christ, budget boats are now 100k? I don’t get it. Tow boats have gone completely off the deep end. I get the bells and whistles thing but a new budget boat is going to give us a 75k better experience?

25k wake...

I wish I had met you before I bought this boat. We wanted a bigger boat, for tahoe, so we didn’t sink, and we wanted a good wake and surf boat. You think you’re getting a bunch because you spend more. All you get are problems. I don’t have a problem fixing my boat, oh yeah, but nobody can tell me what’s wrong with it.

Just like Biggie said “Mo money, Mo problems”.. I think he was talking about boats, in retrospect.


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[Ruger761]

How again is 98k budget friendly? I get that it is half of 196k but Christ, budget boats are now 100k? I don’t get it. Tow boats have gone completely off the deep end. I get the bells and whistles thing but a new budget boat is going to give us a 75k better experience?

25k wake...

I agree with you seems like the sky is the limit. And I'm about to bite that bullet too and order one (Makai not ATX). What's a killer is the price of used boats are almost going up every year because the new ones go up so much. For us planning long term it makes more since to just get what we want one time and be done but its a big pill to swallow. Dang sure not going to be changing it up every few years. Of course you look at board prices and even they keep climbing every year as well as the full wake market goes up. I guess that can be said with just about anything anymore though, except salaries they are slow to climb.

Edit: I will say I like seeing all of the different ideas that all of the companies come up with as its getting easier and easier to set all the boats up. And I get they need funding to pay for R&D, but will be interesting to see what the limit is if there is one.

[D&P Powell]

Let me start with a disclaimer - I have no dog in this fight. We will be keeping our 2015 Z3 for many years. We are not in the market. However, these conversations are fun to follow. We can chat about the price tag all day folks, but this will ALWAYS boil down to supply and demand. If they sale, the price will remain and all these discussions become nothing more than people complaining, but not having an impact on the market. If they dont sale, and the complaining falls on the right ears (ASR anyone?), then changes will be made. Regardless, the market will continue to be driven by the customer. Personally, I think the idea of the ATX is a smart move. Now, where it goes from here, your guess is as good as mine. Again, the market will dictate.

I think I said it before, but my frustration with the whole ATX thing was the idea of low $70k for one. It's just not a realistic number.

Subjective. Define realistic. It may not be realisitic to you, but that does not make it a fact.

You will need to spend WAY more than that to get a usable boat.

Again, subjective. Define usable. Define WAY more.

I guess what I am trying to say, in a nutshell... all these opinions are valid and great, but we all know what opinions are like.

[boonecragun]

Well stated, Dave.

[NICKYPOO]

I get that my idea of a budget boat is only what I think of as a budget boat. That don’t necessarily make it so. It’s not what I think, it’s what the market will bare. I’m more a fan of taking something “old” and turning it into some better. Sonic and his 23v is the perfect example. That boat is bitchin IMO.

So far as things getting easier to set up, the pics I posted couldn’t be an easier set up. The first pic is two 700s full and a sucgate. The second pic was before we put the 700s in. It’s just two 400s full and sucgate. Now that we have the 700s in, we need some bow ballast but a couple humans is doing the trick for now. Simple as it gets.

[MikeB313]

I get that my idea of a budget boat is only what I think of as a budget boat. That don’t necessarily make it so. It’s not what I think, it’s what the market will bare. I’m more a fan of taking something “old” and turning it into some better. Sonic and his 23v is the perfect example. That boat is bitchin IMO.

So far as things getting easier to set up, the pics I posted couldn’t be an easier set up. The first pic is two 700s full and a sucgate. The second pic was before we put the 700s in. It’s just two 400s full and sucgate. Now that we have the 700s in, we need some bow ballast but a couple humans is doing the trick for now. Simple as it gets.

Wave is great and you have it dialed in, but I will disagree with how simple it is based on that setup you described. Not sure if your ballast is all plumbed in, but either way it is not as easy as the ATX. Flip 3 rocker switches to fill all ballast, push 2 buttons on the touch screen and it's done! Doesn't get easier than that.

[D&P Powell]

I’m more a fan of taking something “old” and turning it into some better.

I can respect that. I am more a fan of taking something new and making it mine (tinting the windows, adding GSA, modifying the horn, and FAE coming soon). We all have our preferences I suppose.

[Ruger761]

We all have our preferences I suppose.

Pretty well spot on!

[UNSTUCK]

Subjective. Define realistic. It may not be realistic to you, but that does not make it a fact.

That is true, I am throwing out my options here. I for one am used to seeing MSRP on websites for boat prices. So when I saw it listed at $70k I was already thinking it would sell mid to high $50k as a starting point, like the Max. Now I know the real MSRP is high $80k's so it was not realistic for me to think I could buy an ATX in the $70k's.

Again, subjective. Define usable. Define WAY more.

Yes, subjective. My family will need to spend $30k more to get a usable boat. After spending 4 years on this forum, I believe most on here would need to spend that much as well. If it turns out we could use the 360 engine here than that would cut the price down by around $9k from how my boat was optioned with the 440. So less than WAY more.

I could be mistaken, but when I just went on the ATX build page, there is no "option" to have GSA or not have GSA. I thought they all came with GSA?

TAPS 3T is an option that would set me back almost $4k. The boat does include the ballast system though. Guess this is a wakeboard boat first and surf boat second. Luckily, the tower is also included with the base price.
Can anyone honestly say that they would leave out the surf system on their next build? Very few, I'm sure.

[D&P Powell]

TAPS 3T is an option that would set me back almost $4k... Can anyone honestly say that they would leave out the surf system on their next build? Very few, I'm sure.

Yeah, I went back and noticed I didn't scroll down on the options to see that TAPS 3T is an option. I edited the post, but it appears you saw it before I edited it. I would agree, can't see many folks buying a boat without a surf system.

[NICKYPOO]

Wave is great and you have it dialed in, but I will disagree with how simple it is based on that setup you described. Not sure if your ballast is all plumbed in, but either way it is not as easy as the ATX. Flip 3 rocker switches to fill all ballast, push 2 buttons on the touch screen and it's done! Doesn't get easier than that.

Ya, it’s all plumbed in. Fill em up, slap the gate on and go. 3 less buttons to push. The gate is the most difficult part by far, and it ain’t difficult. At some point we’ll automate that part too. So far as dialing it in, we just fill the ballast, put the gate on and that’s what pops out every time. I rode and drove Zack’s boat last year and it was a pain in the *** and not nearly as good as the 21v. I know he’s done a lot to it since and we haven’t managed to hook up this year but, it’s still the same system. It honestly made me a bigger fan of the 21v and it’s simplicity. I know the new systems on the brand new boats are getting easier and easier but the simplicity of the 21v is undeniable.

[Zackdogg]

ATX

Ya, it’s all plumbed in. Fill em up, slap the gate on and go. 3 less buttons to push. The gate is the most difficult part by far, and it ain’t difficult. At some point we’ll automate that part too. So far as dialing it in, we just fill the ballast, put the gate on and that’s what pops out every time. I rode and drove Zack’s boat last year and it was a pain in the *** and not nearly as good as the 21v. I know he’s done a lot to it since and we haven’t managed to hook up this year but, it’s still the same system. It honestly made me a bigger fan of the 21v and it’s simplicity. I know the new systems on the brand new boats are getting easier and easier but the simplicity of the 21v is undeniable.

You’re 100% right, it is a pain, and that was the same system Tige used until last month. We have it far more dialed, this year, but replicating a wave is near impossible, unless you run with like 4 people, and on the same spot on the same lake, every time.

We do have the wave pretty well figured out, now, at least the goofy wave, but what’s the difference if the boat goes into limp mode while I’m surfing, so I can just run in to transom? Then idle back across the lake, load it on the trailer, and drag it back over the sierras every Monday?

My problem isn’t that everything breaks, well it kinda is, but at least fix the thing, or do something to make it right. Hell, if someone acted like they even give a **** that they jacked up 2 of our short lived summers, that would help. But nope, it’s “we’ll look at it, but we are slammed busy, as you can imagine”, like I’m the ******* nuisance.

At least I have buddies with boats that don’t constantly break, but oh yeah, I still have to make the payment on this one. That’s the great news.

I’m jealous of yours, and our other buddy with the 21v, the old ones seem to run right!


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