R21 wave

[RICKTROTTIER61]

We purchased a 2020 R21 and waiting for spring to get it into the water. Question to R21 owners, Do I need more ballast than stock? Does it produce a big enough wave to surf with out extra ballast? Thank you in advance for your replys.

Rick

[D&P Powell]

We owned a 2014 Z1 for a couple of years before purchasing our Z3. The hull is the same as your R21. "Can you get away without more ballast than stock?" The simple answer is yes. Your follow on question though is the kicker. "Does it produce a big enough wave to surf with out extra ballast?" Again, the simple answer is yes. However, most of us are never satisfied with "big enough". Once you start getting into wake-surfing, you will want more length, more height, and more push. Once you start wanting those, LOOK OUT, LOL. That's where more weight (bigger bags, lead, etc) becomes necessary. We had upgraded bags from Mikes Liguid Audio (on here), AND 1k in lead. Once we tapped that out though, we realized we had to upgrade props, as the stock couldn't get up to speed with all that weight. If you really catch the bug, you may be in the market for a bigger boat in a couple of years. Don't laugh, it's happened to many of us in here. Good luck.

[Sublimer23]

We owned a 2014 Z1 for a couple of years before purchasing our Z3. The hull is the same as your R21. "Can you get away without more ballast than stock?" The simple answer is yes. Your follow on question though is the kicker. "Does it produce a big enough wave to surf with out extra ballast?" Again, the simple answer is yes. However, most of us are never satisfied with "big enough". Once you start getting into wake-surfing, you will want more length, more height, and more push. Once you start wanting those, LOOK OUT, LOL. That's where more weight (bigger bags, lead, etc) becomes necessary. We had upgraded bags from Mikes Liguid Audio (on here), AND 1k in lead. Once we tapped that out though, we realized we had to upgrade props, as the stock couldn't get up to speed with all that weight. If you really catch the bug, you may be in the market for a bigger boat in a couple of years. Don't laugh, it's happened to many of us in here. Good luck.

How much extra weight do you think you are getting with the custom bags? Are they just taller in the rear and go all the way to the locker lid? I run 600 in lead in our r23 and I want more but with just 600 lbs in the rear the boat tows not as nicely. I think if i increased it any I'd need to pull it out when towing and place it up front which just sounds like a pain.

[D&P Powell]

How much extra weight do you think you are getting with the custom bags? Are they just taller in the rear and go all the way to the locker lid? I run 600 in lead in our r23 and I want more but with just 600 lbs in the rear the boat tows not as nicely. I think if i increased it any I'd need to pull it out when towing and place it up front which just sounds like a pain.

I will let Mike chime in on the exact weight increase with the larger bags, but yes, they are taller in the rear and run longer forward. We only tow our boat a few miles to the ramp, so having 1100 back there is no big deal. When we tow it to the reunion (2 hours) every year, we move most of it over the axle in the truck, and some over the axle in the boat. I wouldn't make that a habit though, as it is a LOT to tow that far. It IS a pain, but worth it once in a while in my opinion.

[bsreid]

How much extra weight do you think you are getting with the custom bags? Are they just taller in the rear and go all the way to the locker lid? I run 600 in lead in our r23 and I want more but with just 600 lbs in the rear the boat tows not as nicely. I think if i increased it any I'd need to pull it out when towing and place it up front which just sounds like a pain.

I'm not 100% sure on the new r23 but on the previous z3 models you add custom bags that extend up each storage compartment, at least doubling each rear bag and you have a whole other animal on your hands it's insane. With the new ones I believe they changed the locker size with the hard tanks so things might be a little different, but with the z3s you can fit a 1200. On top of that add some lead and get up to the 5k mark and it gets even better. Can't find the pictures but we had an 800 on the floor and 400 in the bow once too

[D&P Powell]

Can't find the pictures but we had an 800 on the floor and 400 in the bow once too

Challenge ACCEPTED!

[Ironrequiem]

Congrats on new boat!!
I have the 2017 Z1 Surf XL Ballast and an additional 1020lbs of lead.
It does have a surf wave as it is factory, but we get a NICE wave with the additional lead and TAPS3.

I would like to how TAPS 3T would be with my set up.
Maybe next boat

Just as others have said...once you start you ALWAYS want more!!!

[bsreid]

Congrats on new boat!!

I would like to how TAPS 3T would be with my set up.
Maybe next boat

I haven't seen taps 3T on a Z series hull yet but I've spent a ton for time on a z3 with GSA and ooh boy

[Sublimer23]

I wondered if it would be possible to make an attachment/extension to add to the taps3 plates that mimic the tap3t design or at least provided a little more drag, crabbing the boat more. Elevated explained in one of these post why the 3t system was superior because it provided more drag and while creating less lift. It might be tricky because I see the 3t tabs retract very high where the taps3 not so much and even less on the older style that attach to the swim platform etc. You wouldn't want it hanging low and in the water when it wasn't deployed. Something like this would be a lot easier and cost effective rather than switching to GSA plates and doing gel coat work to fill holes etc. Also a better alternative that just adding more and more lead and having to contend with it everywhere you go.

[D&P Powell]

Something like this would be a lot easier and cost effective rather than switching to GSA plates and doing gel coat work to fill holes etc. Also a better alternative that just adding more and more lead and having to contend with it everywhere you go.

I am not so sure it would be a lot easier or more cost effective, to be honest. The gel coat repair was minimal on ours. We don't need nearly as much lead as we used to, but need and want are two different animals. If you have it, why not use it? With that said, a Z3 with TAPS3 and 600 in lead compared to a Z3 with GSA and 600 in lead are two completely different animals. It's not even close.

[bsreid]

Changing out taps 3 to GSA doesn't need any gel coat work, just need to fab up a couple medal brackets. Ive done it, another friend with an rzx3 and two older z3s. And yes I agree with above, GSA weight is more. This is mostly because taps 3 causes way more lift, basically lifting all that weight you just added.

[MtnMan210]

We have a 2019 R21out of the box with factory sub floor and the factory XL ballast in the rear compartments made a wave most of the smaller people in my group could easily surf. However the big guys didnt stand a chance we could get close but just wasnt quite enough. My setup now is perfect any size and skill level to ride and have no issues. the wave is pretty tuneable as far as height length and push. we added a good amount of weight.

with our standard of 4-5 adults in the boat and running the factory ballast, I've added a 350lb fatsac on each rear side seat--so running front to back and run them full. Then I have an 800lb fatsac for the floor and vary the amount depending on people and wave desired. I've rarely even come close to filling it more than about 3/4 full

[Sublimer23]

I am not so sure it would be a lot easier or more cost effective, to be honest. The gel coat repair was minimal on ours. We don't need nearly as much lead as we used to, but need and want are two different animals. If you have it, why not use it? With that said, a Z3 with TAPS3 and 600 in lead compared to a Z3 with GSA and 600 in lead are two completely different animals. It's not even close.

I may have to just bite the bullet

[D&P Powell]

I may have to just bite the bullet

Too bad you aren't closer to Lake Havasu - I would be happy to give you a pull so you could make your own judgement. I keep trying to get someone else down, but he keeps talking about silly wedding plans.

[sandm]

I keep trying to get someone else down, but he keeps talking about silly wedding plans.

HEY!!! I resemble that statement.

for the record, 1 text to show up on new years day I'm waiting for invite #2 to decline since they say 3rd time is a charm.......