2017 RZR Ballast Fill Time + Size Question

[mattymc001]

Hi all, over here in Australia with not that many Tige boat owners to chat to about comparable issues. Also not having a great time dealing with my local dealership. Looking here for some knowledge and potential help, so thanks in advance!

Quick context, purchased boat new in APRIL 2019, yes this year, although it's a 2017 model. Seem to have had ballast issues since the start with the left (port) side pumps not working properly or at all. Long story short, all pumps seem to be working now but....

First question is, what size bags are fitted to the standard 2017 RZR ballast system?

I ask this because when I hit fill all, the front bags both start to over flow at the same time after about 2mins of fill time. I should say that my fill and drain times for all bags are all set to 6mins.
Are the front bags that much smaller than the rear?

The follow up question to this is, the digital reading on the Tige Touch panel just shows the front bags still filling even though they are overflowing! Very confused! The couple of times we did have it working well, it was sweet, and the boat sat really low in the water, especially the bow. Went out riding on Friday with the boat 'fully loaded' with ballast, and the bow of the boat does not seem to be sitting anywhere near as low as it used to.

Any help is appreciated as I have towed it back to the dealership 4 times since owning it to try and get this sorted.

[bsreid]

So the way the touchreen system works with the ballast bags is it runs off of timers that can be programmed into the settings. Now this can have some limitations if you are not starting at the "correct" starting point before filling. If your bags were to drained all the way before filling they will obviously overflow sooner, or if they aren't full at all the timers will stop before the bags are fished filling. Not sure if you have figured this part out yet but once they reach set percent you can tap the + again and it will override the set 100% until stopped. What I would recommend doing is running every drain pump on override but selecting - again after it gets to zero, ensuring no water is coming out the sides. Now fill the bags until they are coming out of the side and the time it takes should be how long the fill timers are set for, assuming everything is working correctly. You also want to do the same for the drains, recording the time it takes to empty from overflowing full.

If you still aren't getting to what you believe is 100% you can lift the centre forward cushion and take a peek to see if the bags are filling, also look under the windshield and forward looking down the ballast vent lines.

For you ballast system assuming it is factory you should have 1600lbs total. 200L 200R in the front, and in the rears 350 in each locker and 250 subfloor beneath that. So it would make sense that your fronts are filling at 1/3 the time as they're 1/3 the capacity. So in simplest terms, override fill on all 4 ballast locations until you see they are actually full and open your rear lockers to check if they are positioned properly.

Hope this helps! Jealous of your warm weather there mate

[chpthril]

I ask this because when I hit fill all, the front bags both start to over flow at the same time after about 2mins of fill time. I should say that my fill and drain times for all bags are all set to 6mins.
Are the front bags that much smaller than the rear?

Yes, the front is that much smaller, yet fed with the same GPH pump. Are you shutting off the pumps based on the ballast gauge or waiting till the drain flow comes to a spit or stops all together? The fact that the bow sacs are overflowing even though the gauge does not show full, points to the timers being off.

200# = 24 gal
1200 GPH pump = 16 GPM real world.
Time to fill = 1.5 mins.

I believe the 1600 total is as bsreid is stated, but IIRC, a 2017 would have moved to Surf-XL which is one 600# sac in each locker, v's sub-floor tank and above floor. If so, this makes it much easier to monitor filling and draining.

Most filling pump issues, is a pump thats air locking. This is usually addressed by reorienting the pump body to better position the pump's outlet. With the floor access open, hear/feel for the pump running, while looking at the clear hose. If the pump is humming but not water rushing through hose, its air locked.

600# = 72 gal
1200 pgh = 16 gpm real world
time to fill = 4.5 min

[Brianrzr]

I have my '14 RZR set for 2 minutes in the front, and 6 in the rear.

[mattymc001]

ballast reply

Thanks for your input friends! Very helpful and appreciated.
Everything that you're saying makes sense, I guess I was just assumming that the Tige Touch system was smarter than it actually is. Meaning, that I would have assummed that from factory, the computer would be calibrated in such a way that it knows that the front sacs are say 200L each, and if the pumps are pumping water at a rate of 1200 GPH then it should know and be able to indicate correct, when it is 50%, 75%, 100%, regardless of fill time. Easy maths.

Now that you have helped me understand the flow rate and sac size, I'll try adjust the fill times to match the flow rate, should work out.

We had tried checking the other things you mentioned too, like hose lines etc...

Good excuse to get the boat back out for a ride! yEW!!!
Thanks again, I knew I would find some good knowledge in here, shame my Aussie Dealer doesn't know this stuff!!! If anyone from the Tige Factory is on here, I hope they are reading this!! Cheers Cheers (from down under)

[chpthril]

There are two major hurdles with the system. 1) The advertised flow is not consistent. Water may leave the pump outlet at a rate of 1200 gph, but may drop to a rate of 900 gph by time the water reaches the sac. This means you could have a different flow rate for each pump and each boat size (meaning different hose lengths). This would require measuring every boats' pumps flow rate, then each would require its own program.

Now, we throw in the difference in flow rate created by the difference in voltage between engine off and engine running. This would require the algorithm to constantly adjust the gauge movement rate, as voltage changes. Or, you design the PDM to supply only 12.0V all the time, regardless of engine running or not. This provides a more predictable flow rate.

[bsreid]

You can reset your timers once you measure the time it takes and the bags will be surprisingly accurate.

[mattymc001]

Thanks again guys, really appreciate the time to reply!!